My goodness, why all the insults? You could have expressed that idea calmly and politely. It’s really unpleasant to read. Why did you insult people from Finland? It’s just disgusting.

I absolutely agree with Tavra.

bruh

Thank you, Tavra.

I don’t think you’re rude in real life. The fact that you wrote this probably means that someone said something just as hurtful to you or your loved ones. That’s normal. At least your previous posts confirm that you’re a good person i think. Your point about AI is spot on.

I don’t think you’re rude in real life. The fact that you wrote this probably means that someone said something just as hurtful to you or your loved ones. That’s normal. At least your previous posts confirm that you’re a good person i think. Your point about AI is spot on.

Was that a joke I didn't get?
Because if you're serious, I need to explain something.

Normal is getting upset, getting angry, writing: "This hurt me, your attacks are unfair because..." Normal is complaining to friends or ignoring others while standing by your convictions, even if others find them wrong.

What's NOT normal is writing a lengthy post in which you methodically humiliate people based on their appearance, sex life, background, or differing opinion, peppering it with self-praise and some veiled threats like "if we met and discussed this in person..."

Let's not normalize public humiliation and telling people to fuck off as something okay. Good people can do ugly things too, but that doesn't mean we should applaud it.

"But drawing itself? Anyone can learn. Even some homeless dude named Vasily."

>exactly this! thats why we would love to see your actual art! every artist at any level still has value. you seem to have an eye for design, as it said your art was put through ai to 'enhance' it. i'm sure AI couldn't just create such unique characters without your art being good enough to capture those details.


"I’m not deleting anything, and I’m definitely not falling to my knees for you."

i don't think anyone wanted you to delete your stuff, we can all see you put a ton of work into the html coding, they just wanted to see your actual artwork behind the ai. people in the community will still be supportive. it may not get the attention and replies of someone with 10-20+ years of drawing experience, but there will be many amateur artists like me who would love to see and comment on your actual art, no matter the skill level.


i'm sorry you had a bad experience here. in my personal experience, i know my brain can make things feel like something bigger is happening. maybe that's what happened here, maybe emotion took over, or maybe something was lost in the original comment thread translation along the way- maybe something taken as passive aggressiveness, but insulting those here over their opinion will only push everyone else- including strangers- further away from you. these insults actually makes you seem more judgmental and closed off than those who simply dislike the ai.

Well, this really is a show of face.

When I came to Iva's bio and saw you had your drawings "corrected" I was a little sad. I genuinely wanted to see your handywork, even if you thought it didn't look professional enough, but I was afraid to ask. I guess my instinct was right, if this is what would've come out of it. I know it's daunting to share what you're not satisfied with, but I'd say that's a big part of being an artist, at least for me. If I never shared that, I'd never get more comfortable with my style. But anyways, that's beside the point. I enjoyed our time together, but with all the attacks in this post, I think I will unfortunately steer clear for now. And I want to add, this is NOT because you use AI. I'm against it personally but to each their own, I don't go around hounding people about it if they're not already shoving it in my face. This is specifically because you resorted to such performance in reply to a few comments which I get could be annoying, but could be just replied to with a reasonable comment back, not a wall of insults.

Goodness gracious. This was a hard read, makes me wish i had the ability block people on here hah..

As much as i hate ai, as it steals from artists like me and my friends and destroys the beautiful planet we live on, i would never go out of my way to insult people in this way regardless of their stance on it, and the fact you can is so strange

"I couldn't give a fuck about your angry comments", and yet you feel the need to debase yourself on the forums like this for everyone to see?

Your point on AI is completely cognizant and reasonable, and I agree with it, to a degree. AI is a controversial tool, especially when used to generate images. But ultimately it is pretty harmless when used by individuals for personal purposes, as long as it isn't used frivolously. While it can help you do things like research, brainstorm, write, and create art, it should never replace your ability to do those things independently. It should be used with the understanding that it isn't perfect, and that any factual claim it makes should be checked for accuracy. Talking to AI should never replace socializing and forming real-life relationships. It probably shouldn't be used in professional contexts, because it isn't good enough to be trusted with sensitive or meaningful data. I'm saying all of this as someone who works in AI training.

Still, people are entitled to have their opinions. AI couldn't exist without the millions of images and texts fed to it, usually without the knowledge or permission of the original creators, and of course those creators are given no compensation. While I suppose you could draw a similarity, I don't find the evolution of a human artist's art style comparable to the way AI creates art. Yes, humans take aspects of the art they like and apply that to their own art, but that is a varied and nuanced application compared to AI, which can only thoughtlessly create the average of the thousands of images in its repertoire that match the user's prompt.

Artists are especially entitled to be wary of a technology that may have stolen from them. Not to mention we already know that AI can be used to generate counterfeit art based on the artwork of a human artist. AI steals opportunities from human artists in this way--that counterfeited art can be sold by third parties, while the original creator of the work used to create the counterfeits earns nothing. The ability of AI to create images for free has already proven tempting to rich companies who choose to AI generate art and advertising material instead of hiring real artists, all to save money that goes to line the pockets of their multi-millionaire CEOs.

AI is also famously damaging to the environment. AI data centers, especially here in the United States, generate pollution that they then put out into the surrounding communities. They use lots of water, though admittedly a casual AI user isn't using any more water talking to ChatGPT than they might by leaving the faucet running while they brush their teeth. AI users should be aware of the potential environmental impacts of using AI, but the onus should be placed upon the AI companies' bad behavior, and the government's lack of discretion. There should be regulations in place to protect real people from the inevitable ramifications of this kind of technology.

Unfortunately I can't take anything you've said about AI seriously. You could have stated your point in a calm and informed manner, but instead you chose to show your ass to a calm and inviting community that would've liked to have heard you out, as per Tavra's post. From what I can tell, your entire post stemmed from Draak and vampirecult politely asking about the original art used in one of your bios, and about Ferne asking that you note that the images there were created with AI.

I assume, based on Ferne's statement, that your bios didn't originally indicate that the images were created with AI, but they've since been updated to say as much, so clearly you agreed with her.

You say you are a well-rounded individual, a good friend, with a tendency towards friendliness. You also say you couldn't give less of a shit about the "hate" you're supposedly receiving. If any of that is the case, then why on earth would you have such an over-reaction to simple, polite requests from members of this community that have a history of being nothing but kind? Did someone insult your use of AI in private? Even if so, this wouldn't have been a warranted response. I hate telling people to be the bigger person, but besides being cruel and making you look bad, your response is a complete waste of your energy. You aren't picking your battles very wisely. I am shocked that, of all things, this would be your hill to die on.

I thought your characters were interesting, though I never got to the opportunity to meet you in the forest. Now I'm glad that that's the case, and I hope I never do encounter you there. The way you're willing to speak about other members of this community is disgusting. So many people caught strays here: why would you insult someone's appearance? Their sex life? The fact they're... Finnish??? Over being gently asked about your AI usage? The only person who has shown their true face is you, and that is the face of a child, immature, and insecure enough to go to bat over questions about AI that you have horribly misinterpreted as attacks upon your character.

I'm shocked and disappointed to see behavior like this here on the forums. The forest is meant to be a kind community. If you aren't willing to live up to that standard and treat the other people here with the kindness they deserve, then you ought not to be part of the community at all. No one here has the power to force you to leave, but I for one will be avoiding you if I see you.

Sorry, am I misunderstanding something here? It seems like you're saying "everyone was rude, but only the original poster here is punished for it", but I don't see anyone other than OP throwing insults and threats around. Almost all of the other replies here (and on the biography) have been mature and civil. Meanwhile OP is making thinly veiled implications that they would physically beat anyone who confronted them on this issue in person, throwing insults about people's weight and sexual history around, and (checks my notes) insulting the entire population of Finland for some reason. I'm not sure that's comparable to a bunch of people saying "Wow, this was really rude of you".

Also:


If you want to communicate effectively with people, then the answer to this is "always", more or less, unless someone has done something to actually wrong you. In no way did any of the communication with OP warrant such an extreme response. No-one is saying you have to be "nice" if someone's upset you, necessarily, but there's a difference between speaking your mind and going on a vicious, unwarranted rant about a bunch of strangers because they politely asked you to edit your behaviour in some way.

I hope you come back to the Forest sometime. It would be a shame to leave it over something like this.

bruh

I’m so happy there are so many kind, thoughtful people in this community. Thank you for being here and for your messages. From my very first day in the Forest, I’ve felt nothing but love and understanding. I don’t know what was here before I arrived, but this is the first time I’ve encountered something so toxic here. It came as a shock to me that there is no punishment for such words, not even a ban…
Of course, I’ve lost all wish to communicate with a person who revealed their true face in writing and insulted my best friends from Finland.

As for AI, Fernelescent is right, it should be noted that the author is an AI if that is indeed the case.

It’s a phenomenon that can’t be stopped. It exists and will only continue to grow in strength. But I believe there will be artists who, even with the help of AI, will be able to capture the essence of their soul, so let’s hope that art doesn’t die completely.

So you really all gathered here and thought that I wrote a long post because of your comments? Is everything okay with your head? This post was written because you offended my friend. You offended a person who did nothing wrong to you. They brought it to the handle. She deleted the biographies and stopped playing. She closed in herself. You were rude. You got what you deserved. And yes, I believe you can use whatever arguments you like in a dispute. But precisely because I was raised with good manners, I didn’t resort to personal attacks. I simply pointed out that if you look as bad as you write which is to say, poorly then it all makes sense to xddddddddddddddd
Adult aunts whose frontal lobes should have formed at the age of 25. Not formed? I'm sorry that you go out into society if you allow yourself to be harassed on the Internet. You can "cancel" me, I don't care. Yes, I'll say it again.
You're ready to kiss each other's asses in the comments. To express tolerance through passive aggression. Too bad you're not following feng shui here. Too bad.


Thanks ladies you showed me what a real kindergarten is like. That made me laugh. Thanksssss <3

Liliooo, I am genuinely speechless over how you think this sort of approach to this issue is in any way acceptable, no matter the reasoning behind it. You've definitely crossed a line here and I really don't think there's a way back from this, but I wanted to say my piece to this mess anyway, since I was involved with the part regarding your friend, and I see my words have been misinterpreted in the worst way possible; intentionally or unintentionally, it doesn't matter.

This all could've been handled in a much more civilized way, without needing to drag the entire community into it who had absolutely nothing to do with it. I am sure there would have been a good middle ground found there that would've been satisfactory to all parties involved. All this really does is make you, and your friends, look really bad. You have only done damage to yourself here by doing this, and I truly wish it hadn't come to this.

There was never any intention to hurt neither you nor your friend, from any of us who were involved in this. You say that we were being rude, but from looking at the comments before your friend decided to delete the said biographies (happened to take a screenshot of them before that), I genuinely don't understand what you mean by this? The purpose of the comments was just to give a headsup or advice rather, that it would be good to credit the AI generated images as such, because truly most of the community doesn't take very kindly to it, for good reasons that has been said here multiple times by now. Alas, there was no mention of that anywhere in the biographies, even after getting complimented on the said image. Under no circumstances was it anyone's wish for your friend to blatantly delete the said biographies, and even more than that, leave the game.

It's fascinating to me how you say you didn't resort to "personal attacks" like you say, but that is quite literally what you have done here, isn't it? In a very childish way, no less. I hope it at the very least brought you some peace to get all that out.

Kitty, I want to think that the original issue might have been because of a language barrier, and maybe even this will be misinterpreted, it happens. But I briefly caught the thread before it was deleted and I didn't see anyone be rude or hostile towards you nor throwing direct accusations? In fact, even in this post, where the author wrote such hateful things (to put it mildly) people are still responding with a LOT of grace.
I feel like this was an attempt to start drama because creating a separate post and spewing all of this here is something I currently don't have words for? They're not even defending you here, but spreading hate, something they claim NOT to be doing while saying they are doing it in your defence based on their last comment.
There are better and more articulated comments than mine that I agree with, that explained why AI is an issue and why it was brought up in the first place, and without a doubt it was never meant as a personal attack towards you but a mere question and correction, and now you know.

It's just that people are all different - for me, these words were a blow) I was impressed. It turns out that you need to specify the author here, I understood ok.
Everyone understands it adequately.
Sometimes a translator won't convey the thought I want to say, but a translator is also an AI)

Original post:

You really love attention, and it shows. You also come across as sweet and kind, but that’s not the case.

Hello TEF player reading this! I'd like to indicate to all TEFc users that the "Dawa" account, which appears to be one of several smurf accounts used by "lilioooo"—as evidenced by their comment here—has been going around falsely accusing users of having unlabelled Generative AI on the website to a degree I have perceived as intentionally misleading, disruptive, and malicious. I believe that this is a false flag operation designed to diminish the credibility of those who raise concerns about the ethics of GenAI usage and presence. Put simply, this user seems to be trying to make people who bring up GenAI in any way other than blind praise look bad. It isn't working, and it just comes across as silly.

I would not be terribly surprised, as I'm sure you all have surmised, if most or even all of the accounts expressing favour for this user's shenanigans are just more smurf accounts. Despite the temptation to do otherwise, as we have followed in TEF for all these years, it is best to not feed the trolls, especially when they're not even particularly interesting or compelling.

Glimpses into the user's comments reveal quite a bit about the perspective of its writer which contextualises these behaviours into something more pitiable than any other reaction I feel.

I'm grateful to our community of artists, rational thinkers, passionate philosophers, and more. It's been inspirational seeing our community respond with sympathy to someone who seems to need help, and being courageous enough to confront injustice where it is perceived. I suspect that this person may be a lost cause, and I value everyone who has tried to encourage them to see rationality, kindness, and sense.

My apologies for dragging this poor, silly thread up again; I simply wanted to ensure that everyone is aware of the extent to which this user appears to be desperate to facilitate this public image of themselves. I hope you have a lovely day, and I'll see you in the Forest!